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Partly this. I had the same calculation buying a hybrid vehicle. I’m averaging 3000 miles a year on my vehicle so gasoline needs to skyrocket or I need to hit the road for a trip.
It may just be a break even. I have serious doubts about any calculations being valid for 30 years given my beliefs about the coming climate disaster. So I’d just do it because I want to.
Probably Rinnai. It’s not the loop that’s built into the heater, it’s just the pump for the loop.
We have one powering all four bathrooms (3 for us, 1 for the unit) and the kitchen with zero issues. You’re more likely to have trouble with water pressure from multiple showers going than a lack of hot water with one of these.
Rinnai is what we have.
back to the future. These look like a flash version of the standard ‘Instantaneous Gas Hot Water Heaters’ that were pretty much standard in houses in Sydney Australia from possibly the 1920’s onwards.
All good points mentioned previously. I have had a couple of experiences with tankless water heaters, and would highly recommend them. With that said there are some things to be aware of:
When I did a large renovation in my prior home, I replaced the exterior traditional water heater (tank) with dual tankless water heaters. I agree having the recirculating pump is a benefit and, for efficiency, an integrated timer was installed so that it came on at a certain time (morning shower) and then was off the remainder of the day. I have similar recirculating pumps on my two water heaters (traditional tanks) in my current home but I now have them controlled via GoogleHome app so that the schedule can be revised from my iPhone or I can turn them on / off as needed. Especially helpful for when the guest house water heater is not in use.
More recently I renovated a 1000 square foot condo (for my brother) and replaced a water heater tank with a tankless unit. Its location was inside the condo, in a laundry closet. People have already mentioned the size of the gas line but it’s also worth noting that because of the heat output they often require new ducting. In this case a dual duct (air intake and heat output) was installed and able to fit in the former duct. … made easier because it was a one story unit.
In both my experiences there was additional noise when they units turn on as well as some electronic beeping. In my first installation the 2 units were installed outside, in a shed like storage room, that was up against a guest bedroom. I made sure that the wall it was installed on was sound insulated and had a plywood wall to minimize the noise. Despite that effort you could hear some faint beeping of the units, when they turned on in the morning.
In the condo, the unit was in a hallway laundry closet with hollow bifold doors, so it was not really possible to mask the noise very well. Before/After pictures attached.
Keep any flammable / combustible items out of the area where the tankless unit is installed. In the shed where my first units were located, I was no longer able to store gas powered garden tools.
It is also recommended to have the unit serviced each year … especially if you have “hard water” so that the pipes can be cleared of mineral deposits.
@HH_AZ, Interesting that you mention the sounds, i.e. beeping. Maybe that has to do with a newer tankless water heater. Ours is about 16 years old. I’ve never heard it make any sounds at all, and it’s in an equipment room that’s directly next to a bathroom. Do you know what the beeping means?
In both systems (Noritz in my prior home, and Rinnai in the condo) I believe the beeping came from the electronic controller for the units. I never did check to see if there was a volume function. Whenever the units were about to engage (either because of a hot water faucet was turned on, or the recirculating pump turned on) there would be some beeping, then you’d hear the gas pilot engage and the unit “fire up” to heat the water.
Thanks for the detailed information, @HH_AZ. Interestingly that there seem to be more cons than pros, yet people that have them seem to like them. What is the primary reason you recommend? Energy savings?
Since the unit would be in my part of the home with lots of noise sources like dogs, I’m not too concerned about noise. Noise that tells me it has turned on is actually a feature as it would let me know the guests were up and showering.
I do have hard water so need to have it serviced or be able to service it myself.
All the the things I listed in my initial post are worth discussing with the seller / installer prior to purchase. Most can be mitigated with foresight.
@HH_AZ, all good points.
I’d add one more factor that pertains to my location—distance.
If we’d tried to use the standard water heater in the old part of our house for the addition I built, it would have been far for hot water to travel to the laundry and bath in the addition—not to mention the need for additional piping through the house. We installed a tankless water heater while the addition was built because of distance (as well as @HH_AZ’s other factors).
Having the Rinnai tankless water heater just one room from the bathroom and two rooms from the laundry provides hot water very quickly.
I am adding a bathroom and kitchen to my office and I have decided on a small electric tank heater. No venting which makes it versatile as far as where I put it and it is cheaper upfront and a fairly ez install. I have already run the electric for this addition when I built my second cabin, also it will be serviced by the whole house generator which covers all three buildings. That being said I have a tankless at home and I put one in the new cabin. I am a fan, but not for every situation.
RR
Where are you located? (sorry if I missed this; I looked through the thread pretty quickly). I really wanted a tankless, but was advised against it because of my location, Washington state, USA. I was told that because the water coming out of the ground here is so cold to begin with, the tankless heater would not be efficient.
I’m in El Paso, TX so water too cold isn’t an issue.
I think that is a good choice! similar to mine in trailer. We would even consider 2 small ones> for home use :kitchen and home use :bathroom.
