Shared rental, people inviting guests over

1

This is more of a rant than anything but I’m curious if anyone has had a similar experience and if maybe I’m overreacting?

I work in Alaska and split my time between homes in AZ and Alaska. I bought a home in Alaska specifically so I could rent out a portion of the home (not the master bedroom or the use of the garage) when I’m not there. I have it listed as a shared rental because there is always the possibility that my work plans could change I need to stay in the home after someone has already booked. All of this is stated up front.

My daughter had some military friends who wanted to visit Alaska and I was 100% sure I would not be there during their stay. My listing does state “no parties or events” but I’ve never given out any specific instructions about this. I’ve been renting a whole house rental for over 8 years and never really had to spell things out regarding parties and gatherings. I’ve had a handful of shared rental guests so far and they’ve all been really respectful with only 2 to 4 people staying at the home and most of the time spent exploring Alaska.

Regardless, the couple that were staying at my home (with a baby which I don’t normally allow but made an exception because these were my daughters friends) were in Alaska visiting an old friend who was graduating from college. I have several cameras that monitor the exterior of my home and I can see the comings and goings. I don’t pay a ton of attention to the alerts I get unless they are excessive. This friend came over and visited several times - staying as late as 3am. I said nothing - didn’t seem to necessarily be anything to react to. But then one night, he rolls up and right behind him rolls up a car of 5 other people - all very young looking. They all get out of the car and excitedly run into the house. This already had me concerned but I still probably wouldn’t have said anything except my phone started going crazy with motion alerts from my cameras. Several of the individuals (not my renters) were going in and out of the house, and some kind of drama was taking place in front of my house. One of the individuals was wandering up the street and across the street in front of my neighbors home. A second individual was out looking for him and a third individual was yelling out the door for him to come back in. Then he got into one of the cars in the driveway and there was an alternating parade of people who came out to have it out with him in the car (I could hear the heated discussion from the cameras as they were opening and closing the car door). One of them ran into the house in tears. So at this point I’m on high alert. I have zero idea what is going on INSIDE my house and I’ve seen no sign of my guests. Another car pulls up and picks up the the guy that has been outside this whole time and I silently hope the drama is over. But a few minutes later I see my two guests plus their friend get in a car and LEAVE. They have now left the 4 other people in my home (two of which were involved in the earlier drama).

I promptly contacted them via airbnb and told them I was not all cool with them leaving my home with people I don’t know still there. I live in this house part time. My things are there. My car is in the garage.

They promptly came back and I could overhear them on camera complaining about how it was a breach of privacy that I was watching them so closely. Just for clarification, I got over 30 alerts on my phone. And the alerts aren’t just for someone moving by a camera. If someone is standing in the driveway for say 10 minutes, that only constitutes one alert. If they leave and come back, that’s another alert, etc.

They seemed genuinely perplexed that I would have a problem with all of this. Apparently they left the baby with the people who stayed behind so they could go out and have a little fun. That seems innocent enough except I’m not sure why it takes 4 people to babysit and after all the drama I really just wanted them ALL to leave!

Ultimately after several emails back and forth, they claim to not have known about all the drama outside and once I pointed out that I don’t sit around and monitor my cameras all the time but I was alarmed because there were over 30 alerts of comings and goings at my home, they seem to understand the gravity of the situation and became very apologetic. That is a whole other issue for me - if they were unaware of all this, then how closely were they watching people inside my home?

I learned later that the group was the mother of the graduating student and her teenage kids that she didn’t feel comfortable leaving at home (but I guess it was ok to bring them to my house?)

My question is - was it unreasonable for me to expect that they would not entertain an unknown group of people at my home without at least giving me a heads up? Was it unreasonable to be upset that they left my house with a group of strangers still there? While this didn’t constitute a true “party” or “event” it was definitely a gathering and the drama alone was enough for me to feel justified in telling them no more entertaining guests in my home.

Has anyone else had an experience like this?

2

During my 4 years of hosting I saw many things that were not reasonable and what we think is reasonable other people think the opposite. Even me being a host myself when I travel some restrictions of other hosts seem completely unreasonable to me and when I posted here I had people diviided into 2 groups, one was telling me how wrong and entitled I am for expecting to just boil water for coffee, another agreed that to be able to make coffee is a basic hospitality. Go figure.

I would also be pissed If I discovered people coming to my house in such quantities and especially when they started scandal outside.
I had it couple times too ,one was for after funeral . There were about 20 people in the house. I couldn’t say anything in that case. They were clean and polite. But I don’t think utavfare to the host to bring such a large party Into the house. All these extra people will use bathrooms and use toilet papers . Imagine renting to 5 and then extra 15 comes. It’s 3 times more usage of water and other products such as soap,etc.
In my early days of hosting I once had a couple who brought another couple . They rented just a room in another house and I was there during their stay. That other couple never left the house , they swam in my pool, used towels , cooked together . They only left for the night.
They rented for a week and in a day three when I noticed that other couple doing their laundry there I asked them to either leave or start paying me rent .
I am sure this couple never even thought for a second they can’t use my house like this. I was there ,vso it’s not like they were hiding from me.
I would put everything in writing: no large gathering at all. Occasional visitor only with my permission.

1 Like
3

Not unreasonable, but IMHO you brought some of it on yourself, more or less – by not sticking to your rules even if the guests were your daughter’s friends, and by not explicitly stating in your House Rules/listing description NO UNREGISTERED GUESTS rather than No parties/events.

Also, when you saw all this coming and going, you should have notified Airbnb and had them evicted/re-home IMMEDIATELY for having an “event” with more people than were registered guests and otherwise violating House Rules, and you are not comfortable with these guests.

3 Likes
4

I’ve said here several times that I take my hat off to remote hosts - I don’t know how they manage to do it. But if you’re going to be a remote host then an element of relaxation seems to be required which we live-nearby hosts don’t need.

Cameras etc. are all very well but they only add to the stress when you have to monitor them and then see something you don’t like.

I like to think of myself as a reasonably civilised person but if I was renting a house that didn’t expressly have rules about the number of people and so on, then I’d assume that taking other people would be okay. In an Airbnb situation, if a host had waived one of the published rules (no babies) then I’d think it was fair to assume that other rules could be waived too.

Hosts need to be in control.

2 Likes
5

This is all good feedback. While I wouldn’t have evicted a couple in Alaska with 2 feet of snow on the ground and a baby, I did let them know how it was not acceptable was going on and it was all documented within the Airbnb communication platform. Regardless, I have now added it to my house rules that “gatherings” are not allowed without previous permission. I need to decide how many unregistered guests should be allowed to visit - but I actually now wonder how to word that given the scenario described above about the couple who had another couple doing laundry, etc. That’s a real head shaker. It’s amazing to me how people can presume so much about someone else’s home.

2 Likes
6

Always stick to your rules and insist on your boundaries being respected. Have your rules on your listing. There’s too much at stake with your home to take risks. No exceptions.

1 Like
7

Dont be amazed. Be prepared. Give an inch people will take a mile.

4 Likes
8

Don’t worry about a number, just say no unregistered guests without 24 hour’s advance notice and approval.

(This after someone brought a friend home with them “is it ok?” …well since he’s standing in front of me and is carrying all your luggage, I guess?)

2 Likes
9

Just to allay any fears or worries that hosts may have regarding visitors of guests: According to Airbnb TOS the guest is fully responsible for their visitors behaviors and actions. Here is the link https://www.airbnb.com/terms/host_guarantee Please refer to the Defined Terms for 1. Covered Losses and 2. Invitee

Per this information I have in my House Rules the following regarding Visitors:

Visitor Policy - You are welcome to have friends and family visit during the day. Please keep in mind this does not authorize anyone to have a party of any kind. Your visitors are not allowed to bathe/shower, sleep in an unused bed or otherwise make use of the home other than to use the toilet and wash hands. If you allow this, you will be charged $25 per person per day. As the booking guest, it is your responsibility to make your visitors aware of the House Rules and see that they follow them. All visitors, unless otherwise authorized, must vacate the premises by no later than 10 PM. Any unauthorized visitors that stay overnight will cause the booking guest to be charged $50 each.

Anyone that wants is welcome to copy, borrow, or otherwise use this wording for their own House Rules.

6 Likes
10

@azstay Yes I did. Just recently in fact. A guest booked for 6 but, like you, I was getting so many motion alerts I checked my cameras and the saved footage. By my count upwards of 14 people were in and out of my house for 2 days. Smoking on the front steps RIGHT NEXT TO THE NO SMOKING WITHIN 15 FEET SIGN!, taking showers (lots of wet heads seen), cooking and taking my pots and pans out of the house to their camper out front, talking loud on cellphones in the front and back yard, AND they illegally downloaded copyrighted materials on my WiFi! I contacted the booking person, like you did, and they were #1 offended that I was “watching them” had to explain like you did, and #2 Assured me they were “nice people” and I was being paranoid even though I had a neighbor call me about the loud cell phone talkers. But they said they would quiet everyone down and be respectful. I didn’t find out about the smoking and showers until I checked footage after they departed. I should have looked sooner I suppose. I contacted Airbnb CS about it, especially the illegal downloading after my ISP informed me and restricted my service until I explained the situation. CS was actually super helpful, got ahold of the guest, basically read them the riot act, got me money for the extra person they admitted to sleeping in the house and then gave me an extra $50 just for the hassle AND showed me how to successfully block, on their suggestion, this guest. All in all it could have been worse. The house wasn’t terribly messy and they didn’t destroy or steal anything. I got lucky this time, they got under my radar. Hopefully, it won’t happen again any time soon. I hope it ended at least as well for you.

To answer all of that statement, in my opinion, no it was NOT unreasonable of you in any form.

11

The thing to do is to tell them neighbors are watching and notified you. The idea that people are offended by being “watched” outside via cameras that are visible and disclosed is funny. It’s sad that we have to fib and/or explain when they are ones violating the rules.

2 Likes
12

Your policy is a great one and I have some info in my rules about no extra guests SLEEPING at the house because I have two rooms but I only rent them to the same party. If they want the extra room, they have to pay more for it. So I don’t want someone paying for one room and being cheap but there are actually 4 people and they use both rooms. So I’ve been ultra clear about that. However none of that (or the visitor policy you have) would have addressed my situation. None of the unregistered guests stayed the night. However they the registered guests did leave them in my house without being present and that was not cool with me at all - especially after all of the earlier drama. I don’t rent out my master bedroom. It’s locked but I any enterprising person could easily pick the lock and go through my room. Maybe it is paranoia but that’s literally what was going through my head when my guests took off and left a group of teenagers at my house (even though apparently their mom was there too).

1 Like
13

I agree! I disclose in my listing that I have recording/monitoring devices on the premise and further state that I have cameras on all my doors. These people definitely knew that because I even had them reset one of the cameras that had gone offline for some reason. I got the impression that they were thinking I was sitting around monitoring the house cameras like a hawk. My camera pops up notifications with a little thumbnail so I can get a pretty good idea from that what triggered the alert (the mailman driving by, etc.) So when I start to see multiple alerts and people coming and going, it shouldn’t be a surprise that I pay attention.

2 Likes
14

@KKC that’s just it, I did tell them that the neighbor called me about the noise. The camera thing came up because I told them I had noticed a lot of people going in and out because I had gotten something like 20 or so motion alerts and had checked the footage. I was out of town with sketchy cell service when they arrived and when I got back into town and had good cell service I got hit with all those alerts.

1 Like
15

You shouldn’t have to justify it at all. It’s whataboutism. “yeah, we shouldn’t be smoking within 15 ft of the house but you’re worse, you shouldn’t be watching us.” People love to call it creepy. I make no apologies for watching people outside where there is no reasonable expectation of privacy. I don’t care if they are smoking or taking a whizz, if I don’t want them doing it on my property I’m going to tell them so.

2 Likes
16

Oh my you had great patience with the situation. Recently had 3 individuals who booked my home under the condition of no parties or events. Upon receipt of a noise complaint from neighbor I walked into a room with 12 people in it, whom I was told was just waiting to go to a concert. I specifically state no unauthorized visitors in the home and the only individuals allowed in the home were the registered guests. They were all kicked out and resv cxl’d. Am dealing with some backlash but all in all it was the right thing in my mind.

17

I had an inquiry that was up front about 6-8 extra guests during the day between their 2 night stay which would have started 12/31. The Gypsy trailer barely holds 4 and dines 3, and the outdoor shade lounge is closed for winter. They would have had the furnished patio with dining and lounging options. I thought I’d consider it but at an inflated price, because he said there’d be no drinking or smoking , just a quiet private re-vow marriage ceremony with meal.

My girlfriend who runs an airbnb said I must not really want any guests!! I honestly was concerned about them getting cold or wet if there was poor weather. He declined immediately in a huff after he saw what it was worth to me ( not to mention air fees) to host his gathering…

18

I’ve got this dilemma atm. Two older ladies are the authorised guests. One has her daughter, son in law and four small grandchildren staying. She claims it “slipped her mind” to advise me. She is offended at my “knowing” despite a webcam sitting above the key safe at the front door.
A second family is also spending hours and hours there…with three more children. So I’ve got towels, linen being used, kids sleeping all over the place given their are 8 people and only beds for 5 max.
My webcam goes off over 25 times a day…so much coming and going!
My husband and I have told her we will advise a fee, which she is extremely unhappy about. We’ve decided not to rock the boat, get them all out on Friday and then make a claim. I’m now trying to change the wording on my listing to avoid such an event ever happening again.
I just hope we can get it cleaned within three hours for our next guests, and they haven’t used too much of our linen/towel supply. Nightmare!

19

Here is what I now include in my listing:

"Shared Rental: Our home is considered a “shared rental” which means we may be onsite in the home at the same time you are visiting.

Because this is our home and we choose our guests carefully, we ask that you not host others (for parties/gatherings/etc.) at our home unless you run it past us in advance. 1-2 Visitors are allowed for short visits. Keep in mind that the use of our home is for registered guests only. Our home is priced in such a way to support only few people in our home using our amenities. At no time should unregistered guests be allowed into our home without you being present. "

1 Like
20

I also have this listed under house rules:

" House is for the use of registered guests only. No events, parties or gatherings without prior approval."

1 Like