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Hi,
I’m host of Airbnb in Italy, i know Airbnb provides the identification of people’s identity with the documents.
I cannot see the documents of my guests directly from Airbnb but i have to require these documents when they arrive for “legal reasons”. It would be helpful for us to acquire the documents directly from Airbnb. Could it be possible to acquire the ID card of the guest before their arrival?
thank you,
Roberto
I would call or message Air directly, rather than asking here.
Someone in Barcelona also recently asked this question. Tell the guests to bring a copy of their passport or ID because, because due to new regulations, traveler IDs have to be reported to the authorities. This is a common thing when you check into a hotel. You give them your passport and they make a copy.
I would be turned off if a host asked for my ID.
Airbnb has copies of my ID and multiple verification methods, hosts themselves shouldn’t need it. I wouldn’t give a host my ID unless the host is also willing to give me their ID. Even then, I would be put off by it. Or, perhaps, if warn all guests in advance if you live in a country where every b&b requires it now (Spain).
Too much ID theft going around for me to want to give my ID to random strangers, especially when I don’t know what they’ll do with it, how they’ll store it, where they’ll send copies, and how they’ll securely dispose of those copies (print and digital shredding). I’ve stayed at thousands of hotels and b&bs, and the majority didn’t scan my ID. Some requested it to look at my name on it, but the majority didn’t scan it- and we’re talking mutli-national huge star hotel chains.
Home owners insurance covers you with or without the guest’s ID, assuming you’re operating within zoning regulations of your city and home owner’s insurance policy. Not having a copy of their ID isn’t a huge risk. They could easily give you a fake ID with fake name, and you’d have some bogus name if they trash your house. Airbnb insurance should also cover you with or without their ID copy.
You could ask for an ID copy – just put in your listing in bold text and in the welcome message very highlighted that you personally require ID copy and won’t allow check-ins without it.
I wouldn’t allow new airbnb users without reviews, or without many reviews. It’s rather unlikely a airbnb guest with 100+ positive reviews wants to suddenly book your listing to rob you. Too much work, and they’ve provided their credit card info. You could accept only guests who give airbnb copies of their government ID and refuse other guests.
If Airbnb is willing to give costs copies of my IDs without my permission, I would delete my account. I would imagine many airbnb users would feel the same about airbnb sharing their ID copies without their permission.
I see your point and it makes a lot of sense. But I still insist on a valid ID. I also insist that the guest (with the valid ID) signs my rental agreement. It’s in my house rules. And if they don’t then I reserve the right to cancel the booking.
The way I see it is if I’m going to trust someone with my $600K house then I better know who they are.
But another issue is a liability issue. I don’t recall which hotel chain had a problem but they were sued for not properly vetting their guest. And they lost big money.
Imagine a scenario where you have a guest who rapes a girl down the street. She sues your guest as well as yourself (I hope that you also have the proper commercial liability insurance).
So if someone is not going to trust me by telling me who they are do we can stick it in a contract then I’m not going to trust them with my house.
The $1,000,000 Airbnb guarantee for hosts doesn’t require you to check ID, and would cover a $600K house, plus $400K leftover for contents.
Like I said, I personally would show my ID to a host so long as they showed me their ID. They might be entrusting me with their building, but I’m entrusting them with my life and safety. If they wanted to copy my ID I would want written standards of how they store & delete that ID copy, and take a copy of their ID too with the same. I’ve got verified ID with Airbnb-- if a host doesn’t trust AIrbnb’s verification methods or my verified account with host reviews, I wouldn’t want to stay in their property unless it was mutual in-person ID verification.
Sex offenders, criminals, etc. have ID most of the time. An ID alone doesn’t help much. Every felon has to start somewhere. 
A lease agreement is useful, as is commercial insurance like you mention.
A person with ID and no criminal record could easily be mentally ill, get drunk, on drugs, have anger management issues- and trash your house. You could easily have some guest with a decades-long criminal history check in with their ID, and you wouldn’t know the difference. With proper insurance and good lawyers, a scenario like the nameless hotel losing huge money in a won legal suit for not vetting their guest would be incredibly rare. Same with an airbnb guest suddenly deciding to harm a neighborhood child and successfully winning a suit against you for accepting an Airbnb guest. Unless you’re doing a criminal history search, you wouldn’t know the difference. Besides, every felon has their first felony. I could see accepting only “Airbnb Verified ID” guests perhaps if preferring less risk over more bookings, it’s the in-person ID outside of AIrbnb that I would decline unless it was mutual ID showing/flashing.
Unless you’re doing full background check, NCIC check, warrant search local and national, local and national court record search, and credit check- why not throw that in too- you’ve still got risk. There are plenty of violent felons who who don’t yet have a criminal record. Everyone has risk. A shady person with ID can easily try to fake an injury and attempt to sue, or a user willing to sign your lease can still sue and a court could still rule on the side of a tenant. Risk is inherent to tenants, having house guest, having friends, having kids, neighbors or strangers walking across your yard and getting injured, having repairmen maids and lawn care staff, etc. You can’t escape risk. And you’ve still got $1 million in an Airbnb guarantee, plus personal home and umbrella insurance.
At least you’re telling your guests before booking your personal house rules-- some guests might avoid your listing, others might not care. For a few nights stay somewhere, I’m not having some host scan my ID on their computer (that easily couldn’t be secure) and sign a residential lease for a few days vacation unless it’s incredibly cheap. The Ritz Carlton doesn’t require all that even for a month’s stay that I’ve stayed before. Some people might be willing to sign all of that for your place, and that’s great that you have a lease with disclaimer signed on top of the insurance. Or maybe you cater to long-term stays.
So, do you allow guests who have Airbnb “validated ID” to book, or do they have to submit their IDs for you on the side for copying on top of that?
I allow validated IDs to book, pending ID verification and lease signing. If they don’t complete these two final steps then my “house rules” state that I can cancel the booking. And AirBnB can’t even hold it against me.
In fact the house rules section is a joke if you have to defend yourself in court. What jurisdiction are you signing under, meaning which laws apply? Where is there even a signature? They’re agreeing to no smoking rules? Great. But what if someone rents for house and uses it as a bordello for a week? Are you also their partner in this?
I understand all of your points and you have done good points but I respectfully disagree ;).
The AirBnB “guarantee” is the first one that will tell you no if a really major problem arises. It’s a marketing ploy. Did you actually read all of three fine print on that? I do contracts for a living by the way so I have a good idea of where this goes.
Also if a guest doesn’t trust you by telling you who they are then I wouldn’t trust them either. And, by the way, all they have to do is Google your home’s address and pull up your County tax bill to know that you’re the owner. You are, after all, the one letting a stranger into your own house.
Would you just let a stranger drive your car without insuring that they have a valid driver’s license and insurance? So why would you trust a commercial listing site be the one telling you that they’ll “protect you”, while they won’t even provide you with the guest’s information. Plus they’re not even telling you that" they’ll protect you ". They’re actually telling you that they won’t (if you read their ToS carefully).
The only ones covered are themselves only since they’re not taking possession of the real transaction between yourself and the guest other than listing and payment processing.
Read their ToS carefully. When the guest books it’s the listing site that’s fully covered, not you.
Even the hotels don’t ask? Well, actually, they do. They run your actual credit card (with your real name) and make you sign this nice paper with lots of fine print every time you check in. If you, carefully, read the fine print you’ll notice that you’re signing their Terms of Service agreement and, believe me, they’re covered.
Also give AirBnB a call and ask them about the rental agreement question. If you push just a little bit they’ll tell you to do what I just said. They have to.
In fact you should have a digitally signed rental agreement that records the IP address of the client and date of signature. That’s the digital paper trail that process that the person with the valid ID is the one that digitally signed the agreement (which States their full name and legal address). It’s legal in court.
All the guest has to do if click on" I Accept ". If they don’t want to do that and they don’t want you to know who they are then that’s a red flag and their $2K weekly rental shouldn’t be as important as your financial security. An IT guy can set up the digital contract signing for you for under $100.00.
And, I’m not saying this to protect myself against a $500 glass counter breaking. It’s the big stuff that you have to worry about.
I.e. hurricane hits, someone blames you for not having adequate evacuation procedures. What’s your insurance company going to do? Assuming that you actually have commercial liability insurance, the first thing that they’re going to ask you for us your rental agreement containing all of those valuable disclaimers. And that’s after the AirBnB " guarantee "tells you that you aren’t covered for this type of circumstance.
Call your insurance company and let them know that you’re doing short term rentals. Make sure that they accept it (many don’t because most homeowners don’t know who they’re actually renting their house out to). It’s very different than long term lease agreements that insurance companies underwrite without an issue. They don’t like short term rentals because of this specific issue that we’re arguing about right now.
Who knows what the issue can be but you can either accept my recommendation or not. That’s up to you.
All of the other listing sites allow you to upload your own rental agreement (HA, FlipKey, etc.). There’s a reason for that. It’s because the actual obligation is between yourself and the guest, not them. No way are they going to hop on board as defenders in a lawsuit that you’re named in. They won’t come to within a mile of it and that’s why the AirBnB " guarantee "will back out.
One more thing. The first thing that an opposing attorney will look at is if you have a rental agreement, the second thing is your insurance policy and the third thing is your personal equity. That’s in the interest of evaluating if there’s money to be made by suing you on behalf of their client. If you’re properly covered then you can actually dissuade potential lawsuits.
I’m not fear mongering but I do advise everyone to check with an attorney to make sure that you’re doing this right and not too trust a commercial " advertising agency" to save you when the worst happens. They won’t hesitate to back out and they’ll point you to multiple clauses in their guarantees and ToS when they do back out.
You know what they say. It’s not if you get sued, it’s when you get sued. If you’re offering a service to the “public” then protect yourself.
I understand your points. I just don’t agree with them.
Get an attorney to check your stuff out. The $1K cost will be well worth it and you’ll realize that I’m right. Expense it as you do with the furnishings of your rental property.
The nice thing is that I’ve never had a guest refuse to show me their ID card or to click on “I accept” for my rental agreement. No one was ever “offended” that I’m seeing their real name and that “it’s a security breach”. If anyone were to tell me that I’d point them to a few other listings that can work for them (other than mine) because I don’t want to leave them in the lurch with their vacation planning.
I hope that I’m not singing to the choir and the only reason that I’m being blunt about this issue is because I know that most homeowners try their best and have good intentions but don’t have an idea of the potential consequences.
Hi @Roberto_da_Pian,
India has a reporting requirement for Foreigners, see http://boi.gov.in/content/form-c.
So, I’ve put the following in my listing:
The Indian Govt’s Bureau of Immigration (under the Ministry of Home Affairs)
requires that people hosting foreigners submit information in a Form C, see (URL
HIDDEN) You could also search for “form c foreigner” for further information. I
apologise for the inconvenience. However, I’ll have to ask you for passport and
travel information on check in. See also Responsible hosting in India - Airbnb Help Centre
(General Regulations → Registration of Guests)
Indian citizens need to submit photo and address ids on check in.
I think it is unlikely that Airbnb will give you anything id related, but of course you could ask them. It might be possible to ask the guests in advance for some information, but I didn’t ask it on the site, because it might be off-putting. This is something you could consider asking the guests to send you after they have booked. However, it might also be Ok if you got it from them at check in. Do you need the information in advance for some reason?
If Italian law requires you to verify id information and/or report it, then I would definitely mention that on your hosting page. And link to a relevant web page if possible. That essentially eliminates the need for justification - nobody argues with the law. If you don’t know whether such information is required, then check on it. And if anyone tells you that checking guest ids on arrival is unnecessary or offensive, they are morons and you should ignore them. Sorry, harsh but true. I actually posted on a related subject on the Airbnb Subreddit, and a majority of the people there took a hostile attitude to the idea of id verification. I’m not sure what planet they think they are on. There are a lot of dumb people in the world.
The Form C requirements say that the details need to be submitted within 24 hours of checkin, so I could (I suppose) make a case for getting the information early. But I’m not inclined to take that 24 hr. requirement so seriously.
Hi @room,
I really don’t think the Airbnb guarantee is worth much. It’s fairly easy to check (just Google) that they make it as difficult as possible for hosts to recover even fairly small amounts on money on even relatively small damages. This is definitely not something to rely on.
Here’s what I have in the first line of my “house rules”:
And this is how my rental agreement looks like when it’s digitally signed (just a click away so it’s not cumbersome:
Guest has electronically signed this document with the following information:
Name of Signer: *************
Time of Signing: Apr 14, 2016 01:44:27 AM
Signed at IP Address: 1.1.111.111
SHORT TERM RENTAL AGREEMENT
This Short Term Rental Agreement (the “Agreement”) is made by and between ********* (“Homeowner”)
and ******** (“Guest”) as of the date last set forth on the signature page of this Agreement. For good and valuable consideration, the sufficiency of which is acknowledged, the parties hereby agree as follows:
I fully agree. It’s a marketing ploy. It’s not an insurance policy. A real insurance policy is underwritten by a regulated insurance company like Lloyd’s for example.
And, beyond the insurance policy, is the contract signed between the person offering the service and the person using the service. The contract is key.
I really wish that homeowners offering short term rentals to the pubic would take this seriously.
Hi @anon66401996,
Did you have your rental agreement reviewed by an attorney? And what is your location? If you are comfortable doing so, can you give us a link to your listing?
I can provide my listing offline if you provide me with your email address. And, yes, my contract was reviewed by an attorney. I’m not an attorney but I have multiple attorneys working for me in my company (my day job) so I know what I’m talking about. I sign off on about thirty contracts a week with major companies (larger than AirBnB and HA by the way).
Just an additional point. Do you realize that if you accept a long term booking (say longer than twenty eight days) that you can’t even evict a non-paying tenant and they can, effectively, become squatters? They warp into long term tenants with long term tenancy laws. In other words it will take you three months and legal fees to get them out of there. You can’t even change the locks or you’re the one breaking the law. They’re no longer “Guests” but long term “Tenants”. Yet, as a short term rental homeowner you’re still paying for the electricity, cable, full insurance coverage and a paid for furnished home. At least long term Tenants are responsible for all of that stuff. But short term rentals are like “hotels” where everything is imputed in the cost of the daily or weekly fees.
In addition to the thousands of dollars in legal fees you may have just ruined your high season (maybe another $30K of lost revenue)? What will AirBnB do then?
So why not have a rental agreement clause specifying that this is a “short term property rental that doesn’t accept long term tenants”?
My vacation rental is located in Florida.
Hi @anon66401996,
Certainly: faheem at faheem dot info. Thanks.
This is location-specific. I’ve heard a lot of Americans say this, so it might be true in the USA, or parts of it. This is unlikely to be the case everywhere.
Actually in a lot of places, the situation is far worse than the US. For example, in India, it’s insanely difficult to evict squatters, because the legal system is so dysfunctional.
Regardless, having a rental agreement is not a bad idea, as long as the guests don’t object. Sounds like a possible topic for another thread…
Of course I’m referencing my area. Everyone has to check the laws in their own areas.
Can you share the rest of it?? I will PM you. Thank you for all of this!
Hi,
I agree with your observations…hosts must look after their own interests. airbnb like all companies use terms to mitigate risks…they will run a mile.
re ID verification…Airbnb do nothing to check what is provided to them, it says as much in the Terms and I also asked them directly and they confirmed when pressed that there is no action taken on their part other than storing the file/link.
So I will also ask for the ID directly, but my problem is, once I get it, I have no idea how to check it…
Any tips on how to check if an ID is actually legit?
Thanks!
Calling the DMV will verify the authenticity of a driver’s license.
Guests pay AirBnB directly so we have no way of cross checking CC details with the I.D.
Fraud can’t be eliminated but I don’t think that someone will go to the trouble of falsifying documents just so that can rent a house for a week. There are more lucrative ventures with falsified documents I’m sure.
I’m ok as long as the I.D. matches the name of the person that signs my rental agreement.
If it’s required I’m confident that we can obtain the necessary information from AirBnB.
But at least you have a point of reference that you can track instead of an anonymous guest coming to your house just because they have one positive review.
Just the fact that you’re asking for this solidifies the rules, I.D. requirements and accountability in front of your guest. It’s like having an alarm system at your house. A potential burglar will move to the next house. If a thief wants to get in then an alarm system won’t stop him but why deal with the hassle when there’s an easier mark right next door?
The issue isn’t fraud. It’s too clarify the terms of the agreement to rent between a guest and a homeowner. Most guests are just normal, honest people so we shouldn’t be worried about being swindled. My worry revolves around being sued for something frivolous or not having recourse if they flood or set fire to my house accidentally. Something like that.
I’m insured but if there’s a third party liability claim then it’s better to have the contract and I.D of the guest on file. At least it will help the insurance company in your defence. You’ll also appreciate it if their claim is larger than your insurance limits per claim.
Your points are excellent…I’m operating on a wing and a prayer here, just long enough to earn enough for the upgrades I want on my humble abode (new windows is the priority), without having to work OT to do it. I’m hoping to ABB just this year and next year.
Thanks a lot.
I didn’t know the DMV did that - great. My house is in Belgium so I’ll have to check the comparable authority.
Appreciate your comments! Very helpful to put things in the right perspective!
I’m also mainly concerned about the big ticket items for liability like you describe - plus squatters and perhaps theft of the entire contents of the house (we live in a quite rural area…).
I’ve been trying to get the proper insurance cover in BE but it seems I’m the first one asking for this…
Would you mind to advise the name of your insurance company? I can ask my insurance broker to check if they cover Belgium…