Guest refusing to cooperate with govt required paperwork (Form C)

[diligentHost]

Why don’t you quote the information from the top of the page of the Bureau of Immigration website: https://boi.gov.in/content/form-c
in your correspondence with guests after booking prior to arrival. It might help avoid this situation in the future.

[Helsi]

I don’t feel hosts should have to provide guests with information about legal requirements for staying in their country whether it is visa requirements or whether there is a legal requirement to fill in a form to register to stay in their country. @diligentHost

This is a common place requirements in many countries including in Europe, Asia and South America.

It is up to the traveller to check requirements before choosing to travel to a destination.

[faheem]

Hi @Allison_H,

Sorry about the slow followup. I’ve not been keeping up with this thread, and am trying to catch up.

@Allison_H

Did the guest book directly through you, or instant book?

I’m not sure what you mean by “book directly”. I don’t use IB. The guest made a booking request through Airbnb, and I accepted it.

@Allison_H

Do you have this form as a requirement in your house rules?

No. I do have the following under
Title and description → Other things to note

The Indian Govt’s Bureau of Immigration (under the Ministry of Home Affairs) requires that people hosting foreigners submit information in a Form C, see Guidance on Foreigner Registration (FRRO) Process for hosts in India - Airbnb Help Centre. You could also search for “form c foreigner” for further information. I apologise for the inconvenience. However, I’ll have to ask you for passport and travel information on check in. See also Responsible hosting in India - Airbnb Help Centre (General Regulations → Registration of Guests)

Should it be in the house rules? And if so, how does the wording above sound? And if I should add it to the House Rules, should I remove it from the description section, or just have it twice in the listing?

@Allison_H

Even if it isn’t IB, so long as you have the form requirement in your house rules, you should be able to cancel with penalty to the guest for refusing to comply with the rules they accepted at booking.

I see. Can you point to where this is documented?

@Allison_H

I’m not sure if you can salvage it with this reservation because they’re loathe to revisit decisions, but I’d argue this point.

Usually they just ignore you.

@Allison_H

In the future, ask that it be cancelled in accordance with your cancellation policy, specifically pointing out that the guest is breaking house rules (and not providing required trip info if IB’d). By asking “without penalty to me” - that’s all they did - no penalty to you or the guest, but no money either.

Right, I should have been more careful in the first place. Airbnb seizes every opportunity to ignore the cancellation policy in favor of the guest. Thanks, that’s good advice.

[faheem]

Hi @dpfromva,

@dpfromva

So annoying! Maybe try posting on Airbnb facebook site “Airbnb wouldn’t let me collect on a rental unless I agreed to violate the law.” Then explain as you have.

Thank you for the suggestion. A few questions.

1. Can you tell me exactly which Facebook page you’re talking about?

2. Do you know of instances of people for whom this has worked?

3. Are there any instances on record that you (or anyone else) are aware of, where Airbnb has retaliated by kicking people who complained off the platform?

Oh, and technically “Airbnb wouldn’t let me collect on a rental unless I agreed to violate the law.” isn’t really an accurate summary of what happened. Maybe good enough for Fox News.

Hi @Jefferson,

@Jefferson

Also post it on Twitter - airbnb seems sensitive to pressure applied through social media.

Thank you for the suggestion. Two questions

1. Which Airbnb Twitter account are you referring to, exactly?

2. How would you suggest one condense such a complaint into a tweet? Which has severely limited length, as you know.

[Chris]

I think you made the whole thing more complex than it is, and brought this upon yourself.

Why discuss all this upfront? You have to upload the information within 24 hours after arrival.

Why put all this in your listing and give your guest stuff to think and argue about.

We have these same requirements, all my guest have to fill out the form upon arrival before receiving the key. Never had any discussion.

[Helsi]

Wow @Chris why be so nasty and unsympathetic to a fellow host (sadly not for the first time).

Why would it have been better to have a guest be at your place refusing to complete a legally mandated piece of government paperwork, arguing about it with and then having to have to work with Airbnb to have the guest leave???

Just because you have never had anyone refuse to complete paperwork on arrival doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen to others.

[Chris]

I don’t care about your personal feelings against me, that is your problem not mine.

Being sympathetic and encourage him in his mistakes does not help him at all.

When the guest is on your doorstep there will be no refusal or discussion. They see the official form and will fill it out.
What else will they do? Leave and look for an other place?

And there will be no discussion with AirBnB when they decide to not fill out the form and leave.

[Helsi]

I don’t have feelings for you one way or the other - I was simply commenting based on your general trend of unsympathetic responses to other hosts @Chris

You can be sympathetic/empathetic - while at the same time letting @faheem know what you would do in his situation.

The issue is you haven’t thought your ‘advice’ through properly - if a host has a flexible cancellation policy and the guest decides not to stay on arrival, then the host for a longer than one night stay could end up not only with a stressful confrontation with a guest (not great in a situation like Faheem’s where they let out to multiple guests) but could end up losing a substantial amount of income for a longer stay guest in listings which don’t attract last minute stays like @faheem’s.

As I already said you can’t state as a fact “When the guest is on your doorstep there will be no refusal or discussion” - just because it hasn’t happened to you - doesn’t mean it can’t or won’t happen.

[faheem]

Hi @RiverRock,

@RiverRock

I communicate via the platform, via phone and text and actually IN PERSON! Imagine that. IF I ever have an issue I need to involve air in, which I have not as a host, and I have texts on my phone I will screenshot them. Same with emails. Maybe texting on the Air platform is ideal, but it is not always practical.

Thank you for your thoughts.

I agree with @NordlingHouse that it’s best if reservation related conversation occurs in Airbnb Messaging. Because Airbnb can always say that they can’t prove the authenticity of messages happening in other places. Though no Airbnb rep has ever said that to me. At a minimum it should be in writing. Based on the problem I had with a French guest in 2016, Airbnb does at least require a written record.

And ideally one would try to push conversations happening elsewhere back to Airbnb Messaging too. But one doesn’t always remember to do so. And it can also come across as aggressive and odd. In any case, for me, disputes about the reservation are relatively rare. So these situations don’t happen that often. Which makes it all the more difficult to remember to do so.

[faheem]

Hi @diligentHost,

@diligentHost

Why don’t you quote the information from the top of the page of the Bureau of Immigration website: https://boi.gov.in/content/form-c
in your correspondence with guests after booking prior to arrival. It might help avoid this situation in the future.

I send the guests a lengthy email about Form C to the guests as soon as they book. This email has a blank copy of Form C as a PDF attachment. Normally guests ignore this email, and don’t bring it up unless I do. I usually end up giving them a printed out copy of Form C to fill in when they arrive. Sometimes I fill it in for them. To be clear, are you suggesting that I include the following wording? I guess I could stick it somewhere early in my writeup.

##################################################

Any Hotel/ Guest House/ Dharmashala/Individual House/ University/ Hospital/ Institute/ Others etc. who provide accommodation to foreigners must submit the details of the residing foreigner in Form C to the Registration authorities within 24 hours of the arrival of the foreigner at their premises. This will help the registration authorities in locating and tracking the foreigners. This document provides the functionality of registration process of Hotel/ Guest House/ Dharmashala/Individual House / University/ Hospital/ Institute/ Others etc. owners for Form-C.

##################################################

[faheem]

Hi @Helsi,

@Helsi

I don’t feel hosts should have to provide guests with information about legal requirements for staying in their country whether it is visa requirements or whether there is a legal requirement to fill in a form to register to stay in their country. @Kathy_Spiro

That’s certainly one point of view, but I think on balance it is better to give guests a heads up. In theory I’d like them to fill in the form and return it to me in advance of their arrival, but that doesn’t happen often. Also, it gives them a chance to object, in case they don’t like it. Actually, it’s not uncommon for guests to complain about it, but I think this guest is the first to actually refuse, in 3 1/2 years of hosting, and over 200 guests.

@Helsi

It is up to the traveller to check requirements before choosing to travel to a destination.

It’s quite rare for international travellers to know about this paperwork requirement. Even in India, most BNBs and hotels don’t see to be aware of it. Or at least, they don’t seem to bother with it, based on what I have heard. I myself was pointed to it by a French person in a chat room. I probably would have heard of it anyway, since AIrbnb does mention it occasionally, for example.

[faheem]

Hi @Chris,

@Chris

I think you made the whole thing more complex than it is, and brought this upon yourself.

Why discuss all this upfront? You have to upload the information within 24 hours after arrival.

Why put all this in your listing and give your guest stuff to think and argue about.

We have these same requirements, all my guest have to fill out the form upon arrival before receiving the key. Never had any discussion.

Thank you for your viewpoint. However, I don’t feel comfortable springing something like this on guests without warning. And possibly forcing a confrontation sounds unpleasant. And in the event that the guest has a problem with it, the chance of a bad review is quite likely, whether they stay or leave. Overall, I think your recommendation is certainly a defensible choice, unless one is legally required to disclose such things in advance. And I do not know whether that is the case, or not. To some extent I guess it’s a matter of different hosting styles.

[Chris]

@faheem

Thank you for your viewpoint. However, I don’t feel comfortable springing something like this on guests without warning. And possibly forcing a confrontation sounds unpleasant. And in the event that the guest has a problem with it, the chance of a bad review is quite likely, whether they stay or leave. Overall, I think your recommendation is certainly a defensible choice, unless one is legally required to disclose such things in advance. And I do not know whether that is the case, or not. To some extent I guess it’s a matter of different hosting styles.

Are you familiar with the saying: “Something is not a problem until you decide to make one out of it.”

The kind of data the request is required to hand over, is pretty standard, nothing special. Most Airlines, hotels and accommodations in Europe ask for this data.

By explicitly mentioning it in you listing you make it seem very huge and important, and not normal. So this makes guest worry.

My guest can check in online, before arrival, and will be asked the same information. A lot of guest complete online form, others prefer not to send this data over the internet, which I can accept.

At check in there is no confrontation, because I do not make an issue out of it. At the start of the check in, give them the form and a pen, and ask them to fill it out, in order to complete the check-in.

I once had a guest asking me, what would happen if he did not, I told him I would have to report him to the police for suspicious behavior( which i the truth). He then completed the form without further argument.

[diligentHost]

The thought behind my suggestion was just that if a guest was suspicious about being asked to fill in this form, they could see that it was required by the government, that you are not making it up.